A good discussion, by a lawyer of a victim, including how the past tense makes it easier. He does welcome being open but not half-measures:
It is all to the good to call Obama, e.g., out for making excuses and ignoring treaty obligations, especially if blame is shared for society in general who share the sentiment. The buck stops with him but along with past wrongs like slavery or racial segregation, singling out him at some point misleads. There is no realistic chance he is going to put things on the line and in effect say that Bush and Cheney should be in the dock. The President is not some savior who is going to jump far outside of the public on this subject though it would be nice if he did. And, I think it somewhat unfair (only somewhat -- really, the comments of a few strongly denouncing him doesn't cancel out the normal line which except for now and then ignores it) to single out only one part of President Obama's remarks. POTUS said we "tortured" and “we did some things that were wrong." The past tense is noted, but even that is too much for some people. He didn't say it was justified because of 9/11. It was "wrong" and it was "torture." This is notable though you know ... FERGUSON.
That is the bare minimum necessary to reduce mistreatment, including torture, in the future. You need to say it is wrong -- not too long ago, the official line was that it was right and saying waterboarding was illegal was just so hard. Also, the Senate report is notable in itself -- it might not seem like much, but these investigations are official accounts that put on record what happened. It's sort of like bashing the MSM and using them as source material. Again, it isn't enough, but it is part of the bare minimum. It also provides an oversight role for the legislature, members of whom will continue to feel an obligation or at least right to see what is going on at least to some degree. This too will on some level serve as a check.
It is all very depressing and on some level what is done seems so trivial, even when it takes a lot of work and a bit of courage to do them. Thanks for those who fight the good fight, present tense.
To acknowledge that we tortured people in our custody is all to the good. Indeed, we should do more than acknowledge it; we should make a careful and complete accounting, and if the Senate report is ever released, we may go far toward precisely that. But to imagine that all this was the product of a past that bears no connection to the present is foolish. Worse, if we reclaim torture but ignore the public institutions and political assumptions that led to this behavior, we are willfully ignorant. And if we fail to see that they are with us still, in surveillance that accepts no limit, drones that observe no boundaries, and a war that cannot end, we are truly blind.I agree it is easy to say "it's all in the past" but do welcome use of the "t" word, which wasn't used in part because of its moral and legal imagery. Some was like "just can't figure out where the line is!" and like those who make "marriage" small (just to make children the old fashioned way!), wanted to cheapen and downplay something that horrified for centuries. Only something akin to the rack would be clear enough for them, though there were cases of people hung up and suffering something not too far from that. Basically, "torture" is something "illegal" that wasn't done (or now "done" but "what is past is past"). The present matters too.
It is all to the good to call Obama, e.g., out for making excuses and ignoring treaty obligations, especially if blame is shared for society in general who share the sentiment. The buck stops with him but along with past wrongs like slavery or racial segregation, singling out him at some point misleads. There is no realistic chance he is going to put things on the line and in effect say that Bush and Cheney should be in the dock. The President is not some savior who is going to jump far outside of the public on this subject though it would be nice if he did. And, I think it somewhat unfair (only somewhat -- really, the comments of a few strongly denouncing him doesn't cancel out the normal line which except for now and then ignores it) to single out only one part of President Obama's remarks. POTUS said we "tortured" and “we did some things that were wrong." The past tense is noted, but even that is too much for some people. He didn't say it was justified because of 9/11. It was "wrong" and it was "torture." This is notable though you know ... FERGUSON.
That is the bare minimum necessary to reduce mistreatment, including torture, in the future. You need to say it is wrong -- not too long ago, the official line was that it was right and saying waterboarding was illegal was just so hard. Also, the Senate report is notable in itself -- it might not seem like much, but these investigations are official accounts that put on record what happened. It's sort of like bashing the MSM and using them as source material. Again, it isn't enough, but it is part of the bare minimum. It also provides an oversight role for the legislature, members of whom will continue to feel an obligation or at least right to see what is going on at least to some degree. This too will on some level serve as a check.
It is all very depressing and on some level what is done seems so trivial, even when it takes a lot of work and a bit of courage to do them. Thanks for those who fight the good fight, present tense.
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Of course those supporting Obama's use of prosecutorial discretion in this instance think he's shredding the Constitution for exercising it in the immigration area. Once again whose ox is being gored is determinative.
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Thanks for your .02!